Will this 13-year-old girl be the next dictator of North Korea?

Kim Jong Un’s mysterious heir apparent, explained.

In the last few years, there has been a notable shift in the state propaganda coming out of North Korea. A young girl — maybe 13 or so — has become a fixture at most major state events. Before an intercontinental ballistic missile launch, she can be seen side by side with her father, North Korean leader Kim Jong Un, inspecting that missile. At some of the country’s massive military parades or at gatherings of world leaders, she receives salutes and bows from North Korean generals and government officials.

The girl’s name is believed to be Kim Ju Ae. The world learned of her existence thanks to five-time NBA champion Dennis Rodman, who was introduced to her during a visit to North Korea more than a decade ago.

Before Kim Ju Ae, the inner workings of North Korea’s ruling family were mostly kept secret. In fact, before Kim Jong Un was chosen to succeed his father, he was kept almost entirely hidden from the public eye. So this sudden spotlight on his daughter, paired with years-old rumors about Kim Jong Un’s health, sparked a massive debate among intelligence communities and North Korea watchers. Is Kim Jong Un just a proud dad showing off his favorite kid? Or is he doing something much bigger — like grooming a teenage girl to eventually take over as supreme leader of a country of 26 million people?

It’s a big question. And it would be a massive cultural change for North Korea’s patriarchal, old-school society, where women are hardly ever in charge. To help explain some of what’s going on in the “hermit kingdom,” the Today, Explained podcast spoke with independent journalist and author Anna Fifield.

Fifield is a former Beijing and Tokyo bureau chief for the Washington Post. She’s also written one of the definitive books on Kim Jong Un’s rise to power — The Great Successor: The Divinely Perfect Destiny of Brilliant Comrade Kim Jong Un. She talks with Today, Explained co-host Noel King to unpack the intelligence black hole surrounding Pyongyang, how Jong Un may be attempting to rewrite the rules of succession, and whether the North Korean elite would ever actually line up behind a teenage girl.

Below is an excerpt of their conversation, edited for length and clarity. There’s much more in the full podcast, so listen to Today, Explained wherever you get podcasts, including Apple Podcasts, Pandora, and Spotify.

Anna, there is a girl who we’ve seen in photos alongside Kim Jong Un. This girl is his daughter. What do we know about her and why is her presence at his side getting so much attention?

There’s a lot we don’t know about her, but what we think we know is that her name is Kim Ju Ae and that she is about 13 years old, and we have a very........

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