Some people love to chit chat and find shooting the breeze with strangers an enjoyable activity. Others, not so much. Whether it’s due to social anxiety or a general loathing of the whole concept, small talk can be frustrating and annoying to some.

But according to communications expert and Stanford lecturer Matt Abrahams, it doesn’t have to be that way. People can not only develop the skills for it, but they can even learn to enjoy small talk with some adjustments to how they engage with it. In his video, “How to Get Good at Small Talk, and Even Enjoy It,” Abrahams first challenges the idea that small talk is unimportant.

“Small talk, I think, is actually a misnomer,” he says. “We refer to small talk as any chit-chat or just conversation that we don’t put a lot of import on, when, in fact, small talk is a wonderful way of connecting, bonding, learning, and growing.” What makes it hard is that we don’t have a script for it. We have to go with whatever’s happening in the moment, and we tend to feel like we’re being tested.

Abrahams explains that people often think of small talk like a game of tennis, where someone lobs the ball to you and you have to figure out how to return it. In reality, it’s more like a game of hacky sack where everyone collaborates toward the shared goal of keeping the sack in the air. Reframing it as a group effort rather than a competition can make small talk more enjoyable and less threatening or scary.

With that mindset, Abrahams offers a series of tips that address people’s common concerns and anxieties about making small talk.

First, shift your mindset

Establish appropriate goals

“Your goal is to be interested, not interesting,” Abrahams says, quoting Rachel Greenwald. “A lot of us go into these situations thinking that we need to be really fascinating, engaging, and interesting, when, in........

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